And you know, it was so weird, but dying was the easier part of it. Kelly Corrigan:And how do we earn it? Im hearing all the music, Im totally tuned in to the right channel, and then just like that, I slip into those mundane irritants., Kelly Corrigan:And then I catch myself, and then I feel this sense of shame, and he said, Its like this. Im so grateful to hear the ways youre connecting with Kate and Kelly. with Kelly Corrigan When bestselling author Kelly Corrigan experienced the death of her dad and dear friend back-to-back, she couldn't shake the feeling that she wasn't living as gratefully as she wanted to. So, todays conversation is about developing language to move us forward when life is well, chronic. Dont worry, and she said, Well, my problem is I cant zip my dress by myself, so I thought if it was a woman, I could ask her to come in, and zip my dress, and I thought, Thats the tiny moments that are so gut-wrenching for a new widow. Kate Bowler:Those ordinary consonants and vowels that, when strung together, offer meaning and points of entry for others. Kelly Corrigan:So, she had to call someone and ask them to come over and zip her dress so she could go to the wedding. All moments, days, chapters are transitory and the good ones leave us as do the bad ones. Im grateful for your wisdom in the messy, the uncertain and the in-between. I was wrong, and that is very soothing, but then that took me back to this moment where I had gone to work for United Way after college, because I was going to save the world, and I was this total do-gooder. It kind of reminded me though, when I was little, my family used to have these mottos, but the mottos were stuff like, Dont get crumbs on the baby, or Be nice to mom. Shes not going to hold their babies.. RELATED LINKS Try this episode's happiness practice: 36 Questions for Increasing Closeness Read Kelly Corrigan's new book, Tell Me More Transcript Weeks later, the missing hamster crawled out from under the stove. Thats where relationship lives is in these tiny moments, and whether you are cognizant of that and tuned into that channel all the time, or not, that is the story of a relationship. Theyre poking for that critical difference to hold on to, and I wanna hug em, and say, I know. I said, No, I just want to go back to Vietnam and do what I was doing. On Sundays, Kelly records a special podcast called, "Thanks for Being Here" where she reads the toasts and tributes that listeners have submitted about those they love. Kate Bowler:Yeah. Kelly Corrigan Wonders: Everything Happens for a - Apple Podcasts This field is for validation purposes and should be left unchanged. Kilpy Its these seemingly trivial moments. Embed. I mean, people are getting colon cancer at your age all the time. Im sorry to ask about the hard part, but would you mind telling me what happened? She totally doesnt get it. Were jumping in way too soon and talking way too much. Kelly Corrigan Wonders podcast - Listen online for free Kelly Corrigan:So, this was about all of these people calling me to say, I heard your friend died. You also realized there was incredible parenting magic in the phrase, Tell me more. So, what is this witchcraft you speak of? Kelly Corrigan:Dont get crumbs on the baby. Theres a title. Leave a review on Apple Podcasts. I was also living only maybe 10 miles from my very old grandma who lived alone, and I kept kind of meaning to go visit her, but its a lot easier to show up at work every day at the United Way, and get kind of righteous about all the people who work for money versus the rest of us who are working for the greater good, than it is to go to your grandmas smelly, weird apartment, and have weird conversations with an 88-year old, you know? Maybe I dont have to be good, but I can try to be least a little better then Ive been so far., Riham:Our family motto is Allah Kareem. You start with, Its like this.. That sounds really right to me. Its completely random. She reflects on her love and loss through ordinary moments and everyday sayings. You could do worse than to live by that one. I didnt engage with her. Writer Kelly Corrigan urges 2021 grads to choose curiosity over judgment Writer Kelly Corrigan is a bestselling memoirist. Kate Bowler:Im Kate Bowler, and this is Everything Happens. Kelly Corrigan:Like, Oh, well we still have sex, so were definitely not going to get a divorce, or you know, Oh my husband doesnt travel, so then were definitely not gonna get a divorce, or you know, I never smoked cigarettes, so Im definitely not going to get breast cancer. Kate Bowler:Well, I accept. Thats where relationship lives is in these tiny moments, and whether you are cognizant of that and tuned into that channel all the time, or not, that is the story of a relationship. I had to make it into a vest to remove it from my body with the tag still on it, you know? Many of you listen to Kelly Corrigan who WFS brought to Charlotte in October 2021. I end up saying to my therapy clients, to my friends, and to my daughter both Change is hard and the stage-specific version of CIH, Middles are awful. Middles are awful: we have to either find language for an ambiguous state or give up on finding it: hard, sweaty work. It doesnt end, and also you cant live there. Kelly Corrigan:But you know, if Im jumping in with my fancy solution two and a half minutes in, I just cut you off, and then we leave each other, and I have this little high like, Ah, I just really helped her, and she walks away thinking, She didnt hear anything I said. Kilpy Kelly Corrigan Wonders on RadioPublic Is this how you would have cared for my son?, and you end up fixating on all of these tiny little things, and at the same time, so overwhelmed by not being sure if its trivial or tragic. Its a sin, its hell. Ryland shined brightly - especially in the darkest places. Kareem means generous. Touching on themes like self-belief, resilience, humility, and justice, this series normalizes the human condition and emphasizes our capacity to grow. Kelly Corrigan:Theyre never going to not do that, and thats how theyre going to raise their kids, and that means shes still here. Diane, Okay. Kilpy Im so sorry youre not going to like any of my answers. Is this how you would have cared for my son?, and you end up fixating on all of these tiny little things, and at the same time, so overwhelmed by not being sure if its trivial or tragic. Kelly also hosts her own podcast Kelly Corrigan Wonders, which she describes as a "place for people who like to laugh while they think." On the podcast, she tackles a different question every month in a series of weekly conversations with some of her favorite thinkers. Team Everything Happens, Kate, Kate Bowler:Yeah, yeah, yeah. Weekly dose of wonder: The glorious sounds of chickens : NPR She totally doesnt get it. Were jumping in way too soon and talking way too much. Team Everything Happens, Kate, I love that youre human- that you cry as easily as I do and that you say youre not normal as often as I do (me about myself of course!). I mean, I remember thinking, when I wasnt sure, when I was in an especially tough moment of illness, every time I would look at Zachs nails I would think, Is this what wouldve happened if I hadnt been here to do this? The words we speak, and the words spoken over us. Its the motto I live by when my opportunities are too big, and my capacity and capabilities too small. Yeah. May you find Christ, comfort, and companions amidst the questions! Kelly Corrigan:And it wasnt my turn for his attention. Kelly Corrigan:I mean, unless youre a monk, and youre meditating for 60 days in a mountain somewhere. This is one of the most moving and important conversations weve ever shared and we thank PBS for supporting this work as well as the Lafayette Library and Learning Center for hosting the shoot. Dont misread this, my mother was a loving woman, but she passed on this legacy, this painful legacy shed been burdened with, that women should take up as little space as possible, risk as little as possible, and hide our lights lest we make fools of ourselves. Maya Shankars Plus One is Christy Warren, a former first responder with 25 years of experience in the field. Its a sin, its hell. Kelly shares her own go to mantra as well as two blessings from frequent Kelly Corrigan Wonders guest Kate Bowler and her co-author/friend/podcast producer Jessica Richies beautiful and extremely useful book: The Lives We Actually Have (100 Blessings for Imperfect Days). You wrote this book in a season of incredible loss. Mahra:Ive been singing these lines from a song by the Avett Brothers to my kids for years, and it goes like this. I mean, that was my big experience of your book. A Way to Make Work More Meaningful (The Science of Thank you for this. Im coming. I think part of why your book is so moving is the way that these sayings crystallize these really big truths about who we are, and also how we should love each other. No one understands what makes a character sing better than Michael Lewis. Kelly Corrigan:Thats not a headline anybody wants to read. She's a podcaster. I dont have the genetic predisposition. Kelly Corrigan:Yeah. I was so mad that I shook the cage a bit, that hamster eating its sibling. So, thats just the question in front of all of us. Please note that this episode references addiction and suicide. Kelly Corrigan:So, I used to go in there and write, and they have a meditation teacher twice a day at 10:00 AM and 3:00 PM, and at first I was sort of sheepish about availing myself of every single employee benefit, but sure enough, eventually I found myself sitting in there, and this guy was kind of amazing. Kelly Corrigan:One that Ive always liked is, Things happen when you leave the house. I think I like the sense of theres something out there that you can tap into. We were living in Damascus, Syria, and whenever one of us asked for something Mom and Dad couldnt afford, Dad would say Allah Kareem. In Arabic, Allah means God. Kate Bowler:Well, your book has such a wonderful collection of phrases around essays, stuff like Tell me more, and you write about incredible things people can say when theyre figuring out the road ahead. Kate Bowler:You are someone who has gotten mixed up in all kinds of things, and I am so glad to know you. Kelly Corrigan:And I should not lose my mind over a shirt I bought on final sale section that didnt fit even though I tried to pull it over myself, and then it got stuck on me, and I had to cut it off with scissors. Team Everything Happens. Kelly Corrigan is a New York Times bestselling author whose first children's book, Hello World, is available now. Kelly Corrigan:Its like a game changer. 5:55. Together, Kate and Kelly explore the phrases we cling to in order to find deeper connection and meaning during difficult times. Even the words left unsaid. Kelly shares a graduation speech, a conversation about takeaways from high school with her daughter and a special reading with Oscar winning actress Helen Hunt. Despair defies description. Kelly Corrigan:Have you ever heard that potted plant theory? It was because I had been selfish, and my dad caught me. So, its funny that that phrase really begat the whole book in a way, because I had been feeling this shame about not really earning my days here, and then Ed and I were at dinner, and we were talking about the difference between saying Im sorry, and saying I was wrong, and I was saying, God, its so much more powerful though in the humility in saying I was wrong.. Shes not going to their wedding, shes not going to pick out wedding dresses with them. Today, Im speaking with New York Times bestselling author, Kelly Corrigan. Im Kate Bowler, and this is Everything Happens. Teri Rose wrote this loving remembrance of her son Ryland. I guess everybody here, these children of mine and my husband, are just too damn busy to get on this, but Im not, so Ill do it, and then I was finishing, and I found a little pile of cut toenails on my kitchen table, and that. Kate Bowler:Absolutely. I think earn is such a good word, because youre talking about such a complicated math. Maya Shankar and Kelly Corrigan in Lafayette, CA. It kind of reminded me though, when I was little, my family used to have these mottos, but the mottos were stuff like, Dont get crumbs on the baby, or Be nice to mom. Thanks for the rebellion and the reminder that we as women take up space, take risks, and even make mistakes! She has a beloved podcast called Everything Happens. I think we make life a little more interesting! I mean, maybe I was projecting, maybe whatever he said in that moment, maybe if he had said peanut butter, and jelly, wed be talking about peanut butter and jelly, but it totally resonated for me in the way that a song lyric does where youre like, I dont know what that means exactly, but Im going to write that down, and put it in my wallet, and its interesting. Theyre poking for that critical difference to hold on to, and I wanna hug em, and say, I know. You are in good company. We can remove the first video in the list to add this one. Kate Bowler:Yeah, yeah, yeah. Best, I was healthy, and then I was sick, and now Im feeling pretty good, and even though the language around immunotherapy isnt perfect, I can happily say that I am in remission. Kate Bowler:Well, the one that we sort of settled on most was, Dont let the turkeys get you down, cause we were all deeply unpopular children, but it did make me think about mottos, and how it sort of defines the season that we live in. So Kelly, welcome. Those ordinary consonants and vowels that, when strung together, offer meaning and points of entry for others. Thats my other life mantra. I was healthy, and then I was sick, and now Im feeling pretty good, and even though the language around immunotherapy isnt perfect, I can happily say that I am in remission. The Best Show with Tom Scharpling. Its completely random. Kilpy Just see who you can bump into out there. To learn more about Tell Me More: Stories about the 12 Things Im Learning to Say, click here. Take 2 - Father Greg Boyle on Character, Change and Kindness Dosing Its all this cumulative effect of a thousand minuscule moments. Kelly Corrigan:I sat at my dining room table, which is place I never write, and I thought, Oh my God, of course I know exactly what this is. I love it that it gives up perfectionism, and it just says, Hey, whats possible today?. A former newspaper columnist and four time bestselling . Now a cognitive scientist and podcaster, Maya grew up immersed in the . Mary Anne, Mary Anne, You are everywhere they are., Kelly Corrigan:I really believe that, even though Im skeptical, and Im mad at people who say, Her spirits still here, and stuff. Like the other day when I was being wheeled into a procedure, the nurse looked at my chart, and then casually said, Colon cancer. They swell, and constrict, and break, and forgive, and behold, because its like this, having a heart. Youve shared some gems with us. Both Kate and Kelly are remarkable women and in tandem they make for great listening. Kate Bowler:Yeah, I believe you. Kate is a young mother, writer and professor who, at age 35, was suddenly diagnosed with Stage IV cancer. Kelly Corrigan:Well, chop-chop kid. Can we trust our gut? Okay, but Im just telling you those kids are waking up every day without her, and theyre going to keep being without her forever. Absolutely enjoy these, the wisdom, the calm, the gentle reminder of our true reality and the essentiality of the connections we make and need to survive and help each other. Kelly, this is such a good reminder that sometimes we inherit tough histories and mottos. After the potency of the crime metaphor wore off, I turned to the vocabulary of religion. You are everywhere they are., Kelly Corrigan:I really believe that, even though Im skeptical, and Im mad at people who say, Her spirits still here, and stuff. Kate Bowler:Oh friend. Click here for discussion questions for this podcast episode. It doesnt end, and also you cant live there. I was in a big, big rush to get in front of him, and say my apology, and be returned to a state of grace, but the fact is that his mom died. Kelly Corrigan:Hearts dont idle. Like, Im just an ordinary person, and I make all the mistakes that everybody else makes and maybe even 10% more, and then there she was, and what she would have done for the life that I was kind of rushing through, multitasking my way through day, after day, and you know, sort of feeling snappish, and then catching myself, and feeling like I should be different. We look forward to having you join in on future conversations! Just get in the mix, get in the line of fire. Thank You for all you do!! Tomorrow, March 28, 2023 would have been his 40th birthday. So, God is generous was my dads way of promising us a better future. That kind of belonging is transcendent, and you just feel it pop up in these little moments. Im so glad youve been plugging in and hope to keep hearing your feedback! Kate Bowler:Yeah, I believe you. You say something thats so weird cause I say it all the time, so when I read it I thought, Did you reach inside my brain? You adopted the phrase, Onward as a bit of a motto. Kelly Corrigan:She cant wear half her clothes because she cant zip them by herself. Forever? Kilpy For every graduate from kindergarten to PhDs -- but especially the kids We should hold hands for a moment, as a way of marking the glory of a family dinner, and they do that. Inspiring and thought-provoking interviews conducted by author Kelly Corrigan. Team Everything Happens. What a unique family motto! But first, we need you to sign in to PBS using one of the services below. Im Kate Bowler, and this is Everything Happens. You start with, Its like this.. So now if a family member is being difficult or misbehaving, we have established ground rules, So and so is family and we dont sell family! Kelly Corrigan:Theyre never going to not do that, and thats how theyre going to raise their kids, and that means shes still here. Kerri, Kelly Corrigan:Yeah. Shed do dishes all day and into the night to just get to listen to her children, just to get to watch them through a one-way glass, you know? Ive read Tell Me More twice already. Kelly Corrigan:Thanks. Michael Murray on the Social Science of Faith Kelly Corrigan Wonders. Kelly Corrigan:Yeah. Your email address will not be published. This interview is perfection. I was so mad that I shook the cage a bit, that hamster eating its sibling. Then I wanted to get right with him, and urgently. Warmly, Our family motto: It isnt help unless someone asks for it. Kate Bowler:Oh friend. I was wrong not to go visit her. For the Love of Conversations: Jen and Kelly on Hard and Beautiful Change And then right on the heels of that, I think, What would Liz do for this?. And let us run with perseverance the race marked out for us Hebrews 12:1 What do you do when life doesnt fit into neat categories? Kelly Corrigan:Youre feeling like ABC, not DEF. So thats the beauty of it. We should thank the chef. Dalai Lama XIV, Cheryl, So, I was wondering, would you mind reading that beautiful passage you wrote about after Liz died? Its the title of my memoir-still-in-progress. I was wrong not to try to ease her days in some way.. This field is for validation purposes and should be left unchanged. Kelly Corrigan:I mean, thats where it is. Kelly Corrigan:I mean, thats where it is. So, maybe when life is chronic, we all need some sayings to anchor us, our very own mottos that guide us through. Jewel and Kelly Corrigan have a conversation in NYC. So, God is generous was my dads way of promising us a better future. Such is a reminder that success is the result of joined efforts and that all of us are touched by the ripples of others contributions. One is called Yesterday and the other is called Tomorrow. Even the words left unsaid. Kelly Corrigan:Dont get crumbs on the baby. Theres a title. They hate it. Like the other day when I was being wheeled into a procedure, the nurse looked at my chart, and then casually said, Colon cancer. Now, eleven years post-cancer, Im still learning to show up and be of use in my life, my marriage, my family and my work for the display of His splendor. Kelly Corrigan:I never came up with any combination that came close to the feeling. Its so that they can identify some critical difference between you and them that makes them feel like they can exhale again. Its the only way to keep the last bit of sanity. Thanks for sharing. I mean, that was my big experience of your book. Kelly Corrigan speaks with Maya Shankar about identity foreclosure, the trouble of cognitive forecasting, and new beginnings. Kate Bowler:Well, the one that we sort of settled on most was, Dont let the turkeys get you down, cause we were all deeply unpopular children, but it did make me think about mottos, and how it sort of defines the season that we live in. Im so thankful I could be a fly on the wall and listen in on your conversation. Kelly Corrigan:And he said, Thats a way to be a parent, which is to say to be there, to be available, to be within view, but not necessarily inserting yourself, because even though as your kids get older and older, it feels like theyre looking for you less and less, it is sort of a comfort to glance over, and see you there, and feel you there, and they would most certainly notice if you werent. Kelly Corrigan:I was perhaps proud about it honestly, and I was reading 7 Habits of Highly Effective People at night with my big fat yellow highlighter, and I was really full of attachment to this identity that I had painted for myself. Kelly Corrigan:Its like a game changer. Kelly Corrigan:And Im getting to walk with them way longer on their road, and I felt this sense that I could never possibly deserve that, that Im not that great a person, or a mom. Michael highlights the importance of . Kelly Corrigan:Where you can feel the person kind of asking around, snooping just enough, and its not for your sake. She lives in Philly and I live in California. Kelly Corrigan Wonders: Michael Murray on the Social Science of Faith CW: death of parent, death of friend to cancer. Kilpy The reach of language can be laughable.. Just do your best. Wondering if youve come across Bahai writings as I find them inspiring in building a circle of friends, a community and help each other grow together. Kelly Corrigan:You know, that I had lost his favor for a moment, and I was just so ashamed. Its probably cause of something youve been eating. Im coming. Series 47: For the Love of Untraditional Traditions Series 46: For the Love of Feeding Your People Series 45: For the Love of Dating, Sex, and Relationships Series 44: Letters from MeCamp 2022 Series 43: For the Love of Conversations Series 42: For the Love of Our Favorite Pastimes Series 41: For the Love of Faith Shakers I went to see her one time. Use one of the services below to sign in to PBS: You've just tried to add this video to My List. Whos going to do this? Onwards, but you use it so beautifully when youre talking about Lizs family and how they are now. Copyright 2023 Apple Inc. All rights reserved. So, I think things happen when you leave the house. This is an amazing story. A huge thank you to Mahra (the song she sings is from When I Drink by The Avett Brothers), Riham, and Cheryl who shared their family mottos with us. Today is the right day to Love, Believe, Do and mostly Live. Kate Bowler:Todays episode is brought to you by our partners, North Carolina Public Radio WUNC, the Lilly Endowment, The Issachar Fund, The John Templeton Foundation, Faith and Leadership: An Online Learning Resource, and Duke Divinity School, and of course, Beverly Abel, Jessica Richie, and Be the Change Revolutions. Kelly Corrigan:And then she died, and my dad called, and my dad had nothing but positive things to say to me my entire life, and he said, You should have gone to see your grandmother more. Kelly Corrigan:My friend Andy Lotts, who is Lizs husband, told me about it, cause hes a mom now, and so we talk mom talk.
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